“What’s Your Favorite Podcast?” Is The Only Question I Hate Being Asked About Podcasting
Mostly because the person asking assumes that someone working in podcasting has the same relationship to podcasts as listeners do.
Welcome to Dispatch #33 of The Audio Insurgent.
For those in the U.S.--it’s Thanksgiving Week. Note I didn’t say “Thanksgiving this week” because we Americans have a habit of turning holidays into week-long events to account for preparation for the holiday, wrap up for time off work, the holiday itself, and the few adjacent days that we turn into quasi-holidays as well to fill out until the nearest weekend.
If there is one thing I’m grateful for professionally, it is that podcasting, audiobooks, streaming, and digital audio have gone mainstream enough that I don’t need to explain them to Aunt Cathy while eating something that used to be a sweet potato, but now seems to be a gooey marshmallow delivery mechanism.
But instead, well-intentioned holiday co-celebrants often ask “So, if you work in podcasting, tell me some of your favorite podcasts!” or “What are you listening to?”
I cringe, and then I struggle to give an answer when I’m asked that question–because…it’s complicated. Today, I have one item (since everyone is busy making pie shells…which is what I actually plan to be doing when this goes out), and why I feel this way about listening to podcasts.
I bet many of you feel the same (but find it awkward to talk about).
So …
[TODAY’S ONLY THING: WHAT’S YOUR FAVORITE PODCAST?]
My business partner Jesse Baker and I were doing a “get to know you” call with a new client the other week, and at the end of the call, one of the client team said to us and said, “So, since you are podcast experts, what is your favorite podcast?”
Jesse and I shot a quick look at each other, then stumbled through the answer.
My default is to point out some rock solidly consistent shows that many find enjoyable, like Criminal, The Stoop, or 99% Invisible. Or I’ll point out something new that I admire and feel deserves more attention, like La Ultima Copa or In The Scenes Behind Plain Sight.
Jesse and I have discussed this question many times, and share a difficulty answering it. We love podcasts…but we also make them, which gives us (and every creator) a very different perspective on this than podcasting listeners.
It’s rare that I discuss this with others (until today), but when I do, they confess they feel the same way.
When I was a younger man, I was obsessed with music (still am, but to a less myopic degree). I worked in a record store, was a DJ, played music occasionally, and spent my first years as a writer writing about…music. I listened to music almost every waking hour of every day.
When the guy who owned the record store I worked in went on vacation, he often had me stay at his house to take care of his very old dog. The first time I did this, I was surprised that even though he was probably a bigger music fan than me, with an even bigger library and encyclopedic knowledge of music, there wasn’t a single record, CD, or cassette in his house, nor anything to play them on. Nothing.
When he got home, I remarked on it, saying it was odd to me.
He looked me straight in the eye and said, “I listen to music all day at work. I talk about music all day at work. When I get home, the last thing I want to hear or talk about…is music.”
I didn’t get it at the time. But now I do.
My family won’t let me play any radio/news/talk/podcasts/spoken word in the car. Why? Because I talk back to the person on the radio or speaking in the podcast. I often provide edit notes on the fly. I’ve tried to stop, but I can’t. I’ll keep my tongue, then hear something that I have strong thoughts on, and I have to say it, out loud, often very loud.
I also do this when I’m walking around the office. When I’m in the garage tinkering. When I’m hiking in the woods. I’ll be listening to something then burst out:
“I wouldn’t start that with a question lead.” …or
“This sound design would be so powerful if it was more confident and less busy.” …or
“That bit could have been 30 seconds shorter.” …or
“The listener isn’t interested in what you did this weekend.” …or
“You lost me two minutes ago and I don’t care.”
I spend so many hours every week listening for professional reasons–listening and giving edit notes, constructive feedback, or guidance–that it is hard to “turn off” when I’m not working. So much so that I often start to do it without even realizing that I’m doing it.
It has annoyed my wife for decades. Now my son can’t stand to be around me when I’m listening to something either. I’ll tap through to a news program or podcast and a family member will simply say, “No,” and tune to something else.
If I had to bet, I’m certain that you do a bit of this yourself too.
Over time I’ve come to accept that listening isn’t something I do for “fun.” Making audio is something I do as a vocation, but whenever I’m listening, it isn’t something I generally do for pleasure or to unwind, exactly. I’m not only giving unrequested notes–but I’m analyzing, decoding, deconstructing, and curiously taking it all apart.
I’m one who believes that I can learn something from almost anyone’s work, which then makes it hard to listen without trying to do that. Don’t get me wrong, I totally LOVE what I do. But that is different and sometimes needs to go away every once in awhile.
My friend Chuck Klosterman once interviewed Eddie Van Halen, who was asked what music he listens to. He replied, “I don’t listen to anything.” When pushed, he said that once he started being a musician, he stopped being a music fan. He didn’t listen to the radio in his car, saying “I prefer the sound of the motor.” He added “It’s an odd thing, but I’ve been this way my whole life. I couldn’t make a contemporary record if I wanted to, because I don’t know what contemporary music sounds like.”
His relationship with music was as a maker, not a listener.
And even though that might strike as a little weird, there is nothing wrong with it. He doesn’t need to be a listener to be a creator. His energy for music flows in a different direction than mine or yours.
So when I’m at a party, meeting someone new, or getting to know a client who is hiring me to help them make a podcast, and they ask, “What’s your favorite podcast?” I struggle because it assumes I have the same relationship to podcasts that they do.
Again, I don’t offer this to imply I have nothing to gain from listening, because I always do. That’s the problem. When I’m winding down, I want to do something else.
And if you feel the same way, there is nothing wrong with that either. It isn’t arrogant nor closed minded nor a deficiency nor a dereliction of duty. Your energy just flows differently because you experience it differently.
There was a time, in podcasting’s early days, where you kind of could listen to everything interesting. There was also a time, around two hundred years ago, that a person could read every book ever published, too. But being well-read is different than reading everything.
So, am I speaking your truth too? Am I full of shit? I’d love to hear your thoughts (which is also a great reminder that whenever you reply to these newsletters, it does go directly back to me and I enjoy hearing from readers).
Okay, that’s it for now. If you celebrate, I hope you have a wonderful Thanksgiving holiday. I’m holding myself to a publishing schedule of once every 2-3 weeks–so there will be another one or two before the year is out (aka, the next time holidays are extended out to a week).
If this was forwarded to you or you read this online, would you mind subscribing?
And while this is free, you are also always welcome to buy my book or (even better) buy me a beer.
Make great things. I’ll be listening…and taking notes.
--Eric